Keep on innovating Roku. Kudos.
http://www.usatoday.com/tech/products/s … 52368412/1
I’d love to see specs/SDK info when you get ready for it (after CES?).
EDIT: Dang. Someone on the main/general forum beat me to it. lol.
Wow. Not bad, not bad at all!
I see a problem though, it won’t work on virtually any TV you may have, since says it needs a new HDL interface support. HDL, i read, does not use any of USB or HDMI protocols while it may use their connectors. I looked up and there seem to be onlyMcouple of TVs so far produced, by Samsung and Toshiba - which i did not see readily available on american market. And those are not just any TVs, they are smart TVs on high-end, with internet connectivity/web browsing built in already. So, if i get such TV, which i bet has Netflix/Amazon/Hulu+/Pandora/Blockbuster - why would i want Roku dongle, out of nostalgia? I read HDL can be converted to HDMI with smart cable or dock… yeah ok, so imagine dock the size of Roku2, what’s the point?
The issue of how this device will be controlled is interesting one, since can’t hope for infrared visibility no more. So it is either bluetooth or HDMI/CEC - i loke the second one better, since it means one can use the TV remote for it.
“EnTerr” wrote:
Wow. Not bad, not bad at all!I see a problem though, it won’t work on virtually any TV you may have, since says it needs a new HDL interface support. HDL, i read, does not use any of USB or HDMI protocols while it may use their connectors. I looked up and there seem to be onlyMcouple of TVs so far produced, by Samsung and Toshiba - which i did not see readily available on american market. And those are not just any TVs, they are smart TVs on high-end, with internet connectivity/web browsing built in already. So, if i get such TV, which i bet has Netflix/Amazon/Hulu+/Pandora/Blockbuster - why would i want Roku dongle, out of nostalgia? I read HDL can be converted to HDMI with smart cable or dock… yeah ok, so imagine dock the size of Roku2, what’s the point?
The issue of how this device will be controlled is interesting one, since can’t hope for infrared visibility no more. So it is either bluetooth or HDMI/CEC - i loke the second one better, since it means one can use the TV remote for it.
According to the Roku blog (http://blog.roku.com/blog/2012/01/04/ro … ing_stick/), “They’ll only need to use one remote for their TV and for streaming.” I wonder if part of the MHL spec is a standardized control scheme that all MHL enabled televisions will include on their remotes.
That’s my understanding too TheEndless. The protocol includes power for the stick via the MHL and also control protocols. So it is the TV that’s getting info from it’s own remote, then sending the info to the stick.
True that only the newest of TVs will have it. But… without it, if you needed a separate power supply and separate remote… you’d have a roku2.
I’ve often wondered over the years about why the new “smart TV” standards were so dumb…building the computer into the TV with no way to upgrade hardware. I realized, of course, that a hardware manufacturer wasn’t very motivated to make, for example, a PCIe slotted TV with a plug-n-upgrade option. You know, unplug the 3 or 4 year old hardware, plug in the new. Of course, that would add a few bucks to the manufacturing costs and complicate the interface. They want you to give the TV to the grandkids and buy a new one. I’m surprised that this MHL standard even made it. lol.
I’ve always thought the computer and TV would merge. Didn’t realize they would build it all into the screen. The screen is one “generic piece” that should be swappable. Like computer monitors used to be…just monitors. Now everyone uses TVs 
This standard was meant for smart phones and such, I believe. Hey… Roku Phone…
The other way to look at it is… why does a TV manufacturer want to be in the software/computer business? Why not just produce a MHL based TV and let “the other guys [like Roku]” produce the software/box for “smarts”. Then the only thing the TV has to have is a small processor for dealing with the remote and protocol. The EXTERNAL device would do the rest and be upgradable. That’s the future market they’re trying to get in on, I’ll bet.
EDIT: HDMI->MHL
“TheEndless” wrote:
According to the Roku blog (http://blog.roku.com/blog/2012/01/04/ro … ing_stick/), “They’ll only need to use one remote for their TV and for streaming.” I wonder if part of the MHL spec is a standardized control scheme that all MHL enabled televisions will include on their remotes.
See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_Hig … ition_Link : “The HDTV remote will control the connected device with guaranteed mixed manufacturer interoperability (CEC).”
See also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HDMI#CEC , CEC is part of HDMI spec and while support not obligatory, it has been implemented already by many.
“MazeWizzard” wrote:
That’s my understanding too TheEndless. The protocol includes power for the stick via the HDMI and also control protocols. So it is the TV that’s getting info from it’s own remote, then sending the info to the stick.
i checked pinout and HDMI by spec provides max 50mA @5V = 0.25W. Roku2 platform requires 5W, 20x is too much of a gap to jump, so dont think standard HDMI can manage it. MDL will be able to provide more power while using HDMI connector but there are practically no TVs with MDL yet… and i wonder if it will we widely implemented, because MDL is protocol for cable-connecting mobile phones to TVs, you think there will be much interest in that?
“EnTerr” wrote:
“MazeWizzard” wrote:
That’s my understanding too TheEndless. The protocol includes power for the stick via the HDMI and also control protocols. So it is the TV that’s getting info from it’s own remote, then sending the info to the stick.
i checked pinout and HDMI by spec provides max 50mA @5V = 0.25W. Roku2 platform requires 5W, 20x is too much of a gap to jump, so dont think standard HDMI can manage it. MDL will be able to provide more power while using HDMI connector but there are practically no TVs with MDL yet… and i wonder if it will we widely implemented, because MDL is protocol for cable-connecting mobile phones to TVs, you think there will be much interest in that?
Yeah… I should have said MHL… not HDMI… my bad. Edited.
This site: http://www.siliconimage.com/technologie … &Section=1
talks about MHL power specs (5 volts, 500 mA = 2.5 watts).
IDK about the MDL stuff. That’s the “fun” part of technology… guessing what standards will come out on top.
“MazeWizzard” wrote:
IDK about the MDL stuff. That’s the “fun” part of technology… guessing what standards will come out on top.
It will be a FANTASTIC niche for Roku if someone releases cheap TVs with MDL but no apps, networking and any smartness. Then this dongle will absolutely smartify such TVs with the bonus pointed out by Wood, to be replaced every few year and different brand TVs will be getting smarter and smarter w/o manufacturer having to invest in app development.
OK. Guess I’m wrong again. Looks like TV manufacturers DO want to be in the PC business:
“MazeWizzard” wrote:
OK. Guess I’m wrong again. Looks like TV manufacturers DO want to be in the PC business:
http://www.usatoday.com/tech/news/story … 52420894/1
Vizio is not typical TV maker, they’ve been known to call “unrepairable” $1500+ TV sets just out of 12mo warranty because of dead LED backlight. So upgrade and long-life is not something on their mind. Sprawling into any electronics that can make money, on the other hand, is: in 2011 they released mobile phone and a tablet (notable feature of the tablet: embedded IR remote blaster)
I was musing over this MHL Roku dongle and there are two things that seem necessary for it (notice nothing in PR release says it won’t have them and Roku seem judicious overall in their designs, so it may happen):
(1) Grow some HDMI cable. Not much, 6" is probably enough to make it easy to plug it in most awkwardly positioned HDMI ports. The concept art shown in the PR blurb shows big docking bay carved in the back of TV to allow HDMI dongles. Tough that, to rely on TV manufacturers wisdom - some put the HDMI ports for straight cable, others seem to think of 90degree angle connectors
(2) Get power port on the other end. The reason being those 99% of TVs that have non-powered HDMI (non MHL) ports. If power can be brought to the dongle, it can work over regular HDMI and still benefit from integrated CEC remote control. Now bringing power does not have to be hard - many TVs have USB ports, so a simple miniUSB cable will suffice. Or you can BYO USB power adapter.
“EnTerr” wrote:
I was musing over this MDL Roku dongle and there are two things that seem necessary for it (notice nothing in PR release says it won’t have them and Roku seem judicious overall in their designs, so it may happen):(1) Grow some HDMI cable. Not much, 6" is probably enough to make it easy to plug it in most awkwardly positioned HDMI ports. The concept art shown in the PR blurb shows big docking bay carved in the back of TV to allow HDMI dongles. Tough that, to rely on TV manufacturers wisdom - some put the HDMI ports for straight cable, others seem to think of 90degree angle connectors
(2) Get power port on the other end. The reason being those 99% of TVs that have non-powered HDMI (non MDL) ports. If power can be brought to the dongle, it can work over regular HDMI and still benefit from integrated CEC remote control. Now bringing power does not have to be hard - many TVs have USB ports, so a simple miniUSB cable will suffice. Or you can BYO USB power adapter.
A year and a half later, it’s “i told you so” lap time:
Roku Stick did not allow for alternative power source and did not get traction since MHL port is uncommon.
Google on the other hand just announced their “Chromecast” dongle and seems to have taken heed of issues (1) and (2) - they include hdmi extender cable and usb cable/adapter in the package. At this point i have not the slightest idea how things will be on the software side (it may gut the streaming market or it may flop like googletv - yet that firmware can evolve). But hardware/price-wise things seem scary for Roku.
PS. here in pictures, what the streaming stick should('ve) include(d): https://support.google.com/chromecast/answer/2998341
